Anonymous #1 2w

I mean I guess, but I want to avoid invalidating the fact that statistically men are more likely to abuse you, and there is a certain fear that comes with that. Kinda like not all bees will sting you, in fact, most won’t, but are some people terrified of the presence of a bee? It’s the idea that they could hurt you that’s scary

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Anonymous #2 2w

Indeed, if you think this quote is anti feminism, I would love to hear your opinions on why

5

Anonymous OP 2w

I just think it’s funny to hear people call themselves that

-3

Anonymous OP 2w

Yeah and there’s also the chance a car will run me over when I walk across the street. Life can be scary

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Anonymous #2 2w

I suppose it is, though I think feminism has taken on a new negative connotation. Maybe advocate for under recognized experiences? Person that cares about other people? Decent human? I just care about those that have been hurt

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Anonymous #3 2w

I don’t think it will be as impactful if you said “oh usually a man”

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Anonymous #3 2w

I’m well aware of where the deflecting term of not all men comes from. “Usually a Man” doesn’t absolve men from recognizing the systemic oppression, at least not in my mind. I do agree that usually is less impactful than always. Maybe “almost always” would be more appropriate. I also don’t think saying usually is a means to protect “good men.” I see it as just a way to avoid absolutist language, which usually is not conducive of productive discussion.

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Anonymous OP 2w

Haha systematic oppression. Men are actually oppressed

0

Anonymous #1 2w

By who other men? Lol

9

Anonymous #3 2w

By women of course

0

Anonymous #1 2w

Lmao

5

Anonymous #3 2w

Men oppress women, women oppress men, and each sex oppresses the other. Happens all the time

5

Anonymous #1 2w

relationships and dynamics can definitely be messy on both sides. But I think it’s also important to remember that personal experiences of mistreatment aren’t equal to the broader patterns of inequality that women have faced historically.

3

Anonymous #1 2w

I think you are using the word oppress wrong

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Anonymous OP 2w

I see you’re point and I don’t think it’s “not feminist” of you to say I don’t believe there is a correct way to do feminism because there will always be grey areas

15

Anonymous #1 2w

That’s a false equivalence and I’m sure you know that. Crossing a street is an active choice to enter into possible danger, but you can prepare for the risks by looking both ways. Abuse from men, or a sting from a bee can happen almost anywhere, including places that you should feel safe, that dramatically increases the anxiety of it happening. Which is why people begin taking preventative measures. Would be more apt if the entire world was a street and you could be struck by a car anywhere

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Anonymous OP 2w

Ok fine here’s a better version of it. We can all die at any time. I could have a brain aneurysm wile typing this. I could be killed in my own apartment by some serial killer. I could accidentally fall and brain myself on the edge of the coffee table. Life has risks. Life is scary. Yes some situations are more dangerous and invite more possibility of getting hurt. It’s life.

0

Anonymous #3 2w

Oppression defined by Merriam Webster as: the state of being subject to unjust treatment or control

4

Anonymous #3 2w

Men are told all the time that they are the reason for almost all problems in society. Men get harsher jail time for the same crime a female commits. Men are sent off to war as expendable pawns in war throughout all of history while women had no danger at all. Men have less support systems when it comes to mental illness even though they have the highest suicide rate between the two sexes

1

Anonymous #1 2w

I get that definition, but “oppression” usually refers to something systemic like a consistent imbalance of power supported by social, political, or cultural structures. What happens between individuals can definitely be unfair or controlling, but that’s not quite the same as oppression in the broader sense.

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Anonymous #3 2w

Unfortunately it appears that my attempt at softening the blow for some men was ineffective lol. Some men are just so sensitive to the idea that women have suffered systemically, they immediately go on the defensive to dissolve that subconscious guilt about their gender. Even when they aren’t being addressed personally. It’s the fault of that very same system that causes these over reactive fits

5

Anonymous #3 2w

There is oppression from both sides. I’m not saying women aren’t oppressed in ways. I’m acknowledging that. However I’m also saying that men are oppressed in ways too

1

Anonymous #1 2w

But those problems come from patriarchal systems that also limit women. The point of feminism isn’t to blame men, it’s to challenge the systems that hurt everyone in different ways. But also I’m not sure how you those problems u listed was a result of “women oppressing men”

3

Anonymous OP 2w

How am I having a fit? I’m just saying there is systematic oppression from both sides. I do acknowledge that there is some systemic oppression of women. And I showed examples of systemic oppression of men.

1

Anonymous #3 2w

Yeah and I gave examples of that from the male side

1

Anonymous #1 2w

Yes but again they are from a patriarchal system not bc women aren’t doing the oppressing back women aren’t even in power to cause those wars. You are so close to the point almost there, bc I agree those points you listed aren’t good for men, I don’t believe they are good for anyone but they aren’t examples of men being oppressed, that’s just the product of a patriarchal society

1

Anonymous #1 2w

Yeah you clearly still don’t get it, but I appreciate that you recognized your first analogy wasn’t applicable. Let’s disregard the fact that none of those scenarios have even a fraction of the statistical likely hood of abuse, particularly sexual, from a man. The prevalence of those dangers isn’t comparable. Do you see serial killers every day? Have you experienced any precursors to having a brain aneurysm that lead you to fear it? Women are surrounded by men. That’s a huge difference

1

Anonymous #3 2w

The point of the original definition of feminism was about that yes and equality. Modern feminism which is happening now is not. It’s about blaming men, blaming and destroying the patriarchy that seems to have worked for a long time. Ok fine women specific examples of oppressing men: expecting them to pay for everything, expecting them to die for them, expecting them to sacrifice their time, money, energy, and happiness for the woman and even the family’s

1

Anonymous OP 2w

Ok then go into the woods where there are no men. Build the infrastructure, maintain it, invent all the technology, and all that. There problem solved

1

Anonymous #3 2w

Yeah not like there was ever a war that was started over a woman. Not like the Trojan Wars was started over a woman. And yet if the patriarchal is so bad, why has it worked for hundreds of years?

1

Anonymous #3 2w

But I already know it doesn’t matter what I say because the goal post will be moved, or my words will be used against me, or I’ll be insulted in some way even when I bring up a valid point so I’m just going to bid you goodbye

1

Anonymous OP 2w

Also men are surrounded by women every day who could lie and give false accusations. Thats a present fear

1

Anonymous #1 2w

This is an example of you having an over reactive fit. You are letting your emotional response distract you from the matter that is being addressed. By responding with all the reasons you feel that you and men are oppressed, you are disregarding that women are.. We can have a conversation about the systemic issue men face if you want, but this derailing is why I said you were having a fit

1

Anonymous #1 2w

You begun this discussion by moving the goal posts brother. “Actually men are oppressed.” This immature response is only further proof of my assertion that some men struggle with being able to accept and engage in proper discourse. Which funnily enough was the reason I posted about changing always a man to usually a man, so that you wouldn’t become so defensive and reactionary. It didn’t work

0

Anonymous OP 2w

Actually it’s just me choosing to be done with the conversation. Keep blaming men and the patriarchy all you want. You’re totally free to do that. There are always problems with every system. I just have been in too many of these conversations and it’s a lose-lose situation so I just want to be done. Hope you can respect that

1

Anonymous OP 2w

My bad I should’ve included also. That’s on me

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Anonymous #1 2w

Nah I totally respect that. Arguments or debates of any kind, especially emotionally charged ones can be draining. I hope you have a good day and can take a relaxing walk in some good weather this weekend

1

Anonymous OP 2w

Thank you. Well I also recognize that there’s no point in debating because it’s always going to be men’s fault so lose lose

0

Anonymous #1 2w

Saying it’s always men’s fault is the exact absolute language I was seeking to remove from the original quote. I think it is naive to assert a single person, place, or thing is responsible for the negative aspects of the society and system we live in today. I’m sorry if you feel that the patriarchal structure of the US that has been built is a problem only created and perpetuated by men. That isn’t the case

2

Anonymous #1 2w

I agree, men are definitely also oppressed. But where that stems from is patriarchal beliefs. Also, 1- the Trojan War was started by a man because he kidnapped a dude’s wife. 2- anyone that just expects you to pay for their meal without prior discussion is an ass, woman or man. 3- the patriarchy “worked” because it was the only option. If a woman spoke up against it in the past she’d get beat.

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Anonymous OP 2w

“Decent human” is more applicable

1

Women already have equal rights, modern feminism isn’t about equal rights anymore it’s about women trying to compete with men and misandry, I’d never support modern feminism

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Anonymous #2 2w

I’d have to disagree there. Yes there are people who use “feminism” as a buffer for their misandry, but I wouldn’t call that modern feminism. Modern feminism is more about fighting for equal rights and social equality (ex abolishing lingering patriarchal expectations for the betterment of women & men) Idk, saying modern feminism is about misandry is like saying Catholicism is about hate. Every group has a bad representative, but that doesn’t mean the whole movement adopts those beliefs.

2

Anonymous #4 2w

The Gen Z pay gap has reversed, young women make more than young men on average, abolishing lingering patriarchal expectations? Men don’t typically hold women to those anymore, that stopped around the 60s, those “Patriarchal expectations” have been declining every sense then. In my opinion modern feminists are fighting a fight that doesn’t exist. At least not in America. Go over to the Middle East and see how bad it is, I bet you’d be greatful for the rights you have here.

0

Anonymous #2 2w

I am and have always been thankful for my rights. When I say “Patriarchal expectations” I am referring to situations such as “the man should pay for both meals” and “if a man pays for your meal, you owe him (sex)”. These are very much so patriarchal expectations and they hurt both women and men. I don’t think it’s fair that little boys are told to “stop crying, boys don’t cry” and “you’re weak if you show emotion”. That hurts their emotional development and can lead to harmful behavior.

7

Anonymous #4 2w

What does any of that have to do with feminism?

4

Anonymous #4 2w

That is the kind of things modern feminists fight against. Yes the majority of the patriarchy is abolished, but there are still harmful aspects lingering. It’s heartbreaking when I hear how that kind of talk hurts the boy’s self esteem. And in extreme cases they take those old patriarchal expectations and hurt others.

5

Anonymous #4 2w

I’ve never heard a modern feminist lead with any of these talking points. You’re using these to gain sympathy points and manipulate the conversation. Modern feminists only talking about killing men, how the world would be better without men, pushing abortion, etc. I’ve never heard modern feminists talk about being concerned with how young boys are treated

0

Anonymous #2 2w

Feminism, specifically modern feminism, is the fight for equality among the sexes. It’s not fair for a guy to have harmful ideologies hammered into him and for it to be ignored. Feminism helped women out of their patriarchal expectations, and now we will fight for the men. At the end of the day, expectations and pressure directed at one sex will ultimately effect the other

4

Anonymous #2 2w

It’s worse in the Middle East? Ah yes, the red herring fallacy of worse problems. Bringing up a situation irrelevant to the discussion of gender inequality in the US to attempt to discredit or divert attention away from the matter at hand. I would agree that societal expectations for women have and continue to change, but if you think that stopped in the 60’s you’re naive. I think this gen Z gap is interesting though, I’d love to do more research, is it just average wages? Lot of variables there

2

Anonymous #2 2w

Then I truly am sorry. I hate that others are using a movement that is supposed to be about equality to veil their misandry. But just because someone else chooses to spread their hate and use feminism as a shield, does not mean I will. They do not speak for this movement, and they do not speak for me.

8

This is making me laugh so hard. You people always seem to know how to pretend like you’re not spewing hate every second of the day towards men, now all of a sudden you’re also fighting for men. This shit never ceases to amaze me. It’s honestly pointless. No accountability Will ever be taken by radicals especially not modern feminists 😂

2

Anonymous #2 2w

It’s the same situation I face as a Catholic. Some people are hiding behind God’s word to spread their hate, but that doesn’t mean I’ll do the same. Genuinely all I want to do is spread awareness and love. I can’t control what someone else does or says, I can only spread what I have learned from being apart of the movement. I’m just happy to have been on the right side of it.

1

Anonymous #4 2w

You’re a radical feminist playing a role. Stop replying to my comments. You’re not ready to tell the truth

2

You’re a radical feminist playing a role. Please don’t reply anymore until you’re ready to tell the truth

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Anonymous #2 2w

I see that you too are having a reactive emotional response. I’m sorry, I know that makes it difficult to engage in mature discourse. You’re cherry picked examples to support your assertion of what modern feminists believe is known as the straw man argument if you’ve heard of it. Where you build up a stance, that all modern feminists want to kill all men, then use criticism of that straw man, or fabricated view of all modern feminism, as a means to support the stance of anti feminist beliefs

0

Anonymous #2 2w

All I can do is reiterate what I believe. I genuinely hate that others have taken something ment to help people as a whole and twisted it to hurt a targeted group. I don’t expect you to believe me, my goal isn’t to get you to be apart of a movement where members have and are still hurting you. I hope you have a wonderful day/ life. ✌️

1

Anonymous #4 2w

It’s pointless, you radicals will use these comparisons such as comparing modern feminism to Catholics but you wouldn’t do the same for Christian’s, it only applies wheb you’re trying to manipulate a conversation in your own favor. This is why no one listens to you in real life and people who tend to be on yours side were on the receiving end of a loss after the election. You shouldn’t be apologizing to me, people are logical in real life. This type of BS only works on the internet

2

Anonymous #2 2w

People are logical in real life? lol you’re not even logical here buddy. Your arguments have been nothing but generalizations, absolutist assumptions, and logical fallacies, and when confronted with your inability to form a coherent or valid argument. You ignore and deflect. I hope your debates in real life are also more logical

0

Anonymous OP 2w

Modern Feminists don’t have a good reputation through society in real life because people are logical(yes), people only listen to their BS on woke college campuses 💀, yes I’m the logical one here. You’re the one making shit up. Modern feminists are known to talk about helping both men and women. They want to do the opposite for men, they’re fascists

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Anonymous #2 2w

Modern feminists aren’t known^

3

Anonymous #2 2w

Are you 16? Why are you so worked up over words? Triggered? A snowflake maybe? Can’t help but noticed you completely avoided the fact that I’ve deconstructed each of your major points as invalid, irrelevant, and illogical. You’ve provided no argument as to otherwise because you don’t have one. You don’t have the maturity to engage in a discussion like this. Maybe when you finish your freshman language course you will. You’re resulting to personal insults cause you’ve been exposed as ignorant

0

Anonymous #7 2w

This is completely irrelevant to literally anything that has been said under this post. Could you elaborate a little on what made you think this comment was applicable here?

1

Anonymous OP 2w

You’re arguing with a wall, and obviously receiving a woke education which isn’t an education at all. If you think this was anywhere near an argument you’re delusional, nothing you said was logical because it was all made up to manipulate what modern feminism really is. Everyone knows what it is and what it’s about. It definitely isn’t about “protecting little boys”, that definitely isn’t a talking point that is associated with modern feminism. Misandry definitely is though.

1

Anonymous #2 2w

Hahahahaha, I would love for you to define what you think a ““woke”” education is. I’m in a masters program to become a therapist, that too woke for you? Also, recognizing logical fallacies is something you’re taught in high school, which you clearly never graduated from. Probably cause you thought it was too woke lol. Google is free, try asking AI, I’m sure it can help you construct a viable talking point. You might learn something too, lord knows you need it

0

Anonymous OP 2w

Psychology is widely known as being primarily left leaning

3

Anonymous OP 2w

People who are losing, just don’t know when you stop. People like you will talk yourself into a whole trying to prove that you’re smart. If you were smart you’d understand the meaning of the words you’re using which you clearly don’t. This is the problem on most woke college campuses, and why their graduates can’t seem to do well amongst society

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Anonymous #2 2w

Maybe you will when you’re 50 years old, half of your hair is shaved off and the only thing you have to show for your life’s work is your pet cat and your rose toy

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Anonymous #7 2w

Well counseling and psychology are different things, but they’re related to each other so I’ll give it to you. Widely known as left leaning according to who? Why do you think that is? Psychology is about studying the brain and how it affects human behavior, there is nothing inherently political about that. What leads you to believe it is? And why left leaning specifically?

1

Anonymous OP 2w

Most psychologists typically tend to lean left. You’re being taught by woke bigots who typically don’t do well amongst society from a social standpoint. You don’t know that? Why are you even in college?

1

Anonymous OP 2w

Im an undergrad psychologist at a top university and I learned it from my professor who is clinical psychologist with a PhD. The fact is that yes most psychologists are left leaning.

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Anonymous #2 2w

I am a man lol, wonder what lead you to the assumption that I wasn’t. Just because you don’t understand logical fallacies doesn’t mean they’re being used incorrectly. Google is free and it will tell you the same as I am. I also think part of your problem is that you see an argument as a competition where only one person wins and the other loses. This is a distorted view of what a discussion should be

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Anonymous #2 2w

When did people forget the difference between causation and correlation. Psychologists and counselors are typically more liberal, but that doesn’t mean it is the result of politicalized education, you don’t know that? That one is a middle school lesson. I also find your claim that counselors are taught by woke bigots hilarious, no profession is more centered around a non judgmental and unconditional positive regard of people and their differences than counseling

2