Anonymous #4 2w

It’s how men are conditioned being a gay man doesn’t erase the privileges they uphold

159

no ? this is called GIRL talk. this is a space for WOMEN. gay men can have their OWN fucking space

174

You are not a girl 😭😭 please🖐️

89

Same goes for you babes. At least OP has an opinion we can all agree on. You’re just bitter

73

“this is a girl btw” moid hands wrote this

64

Anonymous #9 2w

Yup!

64

Anonymous #4 2w

Yay :)

35

Comment Deleted

0

No, sticking with a community that has shown me kindness, or atleast, most of a community.

60

I mean it’s called Girl Talk. Like it’s supposed to be for Girls. I’d say if you’re not a girl get out

-8

Anonymous #9 2w

I would think so…since you’re afab you have a lot of similar experiences growing up and being perceived as a girl

34

I’m not nb but if you grew up socialized as one gender—particularly female and all the societal baggage that comes along with it—even if you’re not actually a woman by identification and you can’t relate to everything that cis women can, there’s still a lot of crossover with lived experience and women are probably a familiar space. Plus, realistically & unfortunately, you’re probably getting treated much the same way out in public unless you appear really more on the masculine side

43

Anonymous #13 2w

Oops didn’t see your reply here before I typed mine out. You said it a lot more succinctly than I did, exactly this

3

Anonymous #3 2w

Now it sounds like you want to replace the word twinks for something else….

167

Anonymous #18 2w

Or maybe she said twinks just as she meant it

66

Anonymous #5 2w

yup

11

Anonymous #9 2w

if you can be in a group called girl talk and not get dysphoria and also are okay with being assumed to be/called a girl, i don’t see the problem 🥰

20

Anonymous #18 2w

Girl stfu no one cares

15

Anonymous #18 2w

It rlly doesn’t, it just sounds like she meant twink

39

Comment Deleted

0

Well some of us do, please respect our comfort and safe space

49

Comment Deleted

0

gay men are still men

88

Anonymous #9 2w

AFABs and trans women are allowed. It’s a female AND woman space only. At least that’s how I think these kinds of spaces should be run

40

Anonymous #26 2w

Trans women makes since because trans women are women. AFAB non binary people and trans men doesn’t make sense because they’re not women.

2

Anonymous #26 2w

Like this mindset is kinda benevolent transphobic

10

Anonymous #3 2w

You’re not understanding what I’m saying so let me clarify. I am not just talking about women. I am also talking about anyone in a female body regardless of gender. Our oppression is not just about gender. It is also about the body we live in. Gynecological care and research is a great example. There needs to be a space where female people (man, NB, woman, ect.) can find mutual support because the oppression of women overlaps with the oppression of females.

16

Anonymous #3 2w

I don’t believe in kicking trans men out of these spaces just on the basis of gender. It is more complicated than that. They will still be the victims of certain forms of misogyny and they deserve support.

7

Anonymous #26 2w

trans men are men and they shouldn’t lurk here. they get a little bit more grace but just like how trans women absolutely should be here (no matter how early they are in their transition), trans men shouldn’t stay here, because they are men.

9

Anonymous #23 2w

You’re just pushing people further into a binary when that’s not how gender or sex works.

15

Anonymous #26 2w

It’s way more harmful to consider trans men as women. But ok

19

Anonymous #27 2w

Never* omg

-2

Anonymous #3 2w

Agreed. Thankfully that’s not what I’m doing. If you can’t see the difference between sex and gender, you’re much more influenced by transphobic rhetoric than you’re claiming I am.

9

Anonymous #3 2w

what gay man is in the womens room?? havent heard of this happening ever pls elucidate

10

Anonymous #27 2w

Not even sure what to say to this?? What part of “you as a man don’t need to be in girl talk” are you not getting ??

25

Anonymous #31 2w

Gay men are always in ladies rooms at bars whenever I go in waiting on their friends it’s weird

38

Anonymous #26 2w

“You were born a woman so I still consider you a woman” is what you’re basically saying.

10

Anonymous #3 2w

like masc presenting ones? full ass guys not tgirls?

-13

Anonymous #31 2w

I said men. Trans women are not men.

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Anonymous #3 2w

hey alright just checkin your words sounded sus but thank you for clarifying o7 i do think gendered bathrooms are stupid but i can see how that would be uncomfortable

-11

Anonymous #31 2w

Idrc if you think gendered bathrooms are stupid. Most women don’t. And most don’t like seeing random men in there as a jump scare

12

Anonymous #3 2w

i didnt say you werent valid? fair opinion i dont really care seeing a guy in there tbh cause its not like its a safe space

-6

Anonymous #31 2w

This is something that happened in theatre dressing rooms in my high school, likely elsewhere too

5

Anonymous #26 2w

i’m not talking about nonbinary people, i’m talking about trans men who already identify within the binary. they are not girls so they shouldn’t be here. nonbinary people who do feel aligned with the term girl in some way are ofc welcome here, and generally nonbinary people who don’t won’t seek this group out.

5

Anonymous #18 2w

yeah i hate it when people use “twink” in a derogatory way. it is homophobic

24

Anonymous #3 2w

weird to exclude nonbinary people who were assigned male at birth especially if their gender identity is a lot closer to “woman” than “man”. feels like a “boy nonbinary and girl nonbinary” moment

6

Anonymous #3 2w

Let’s not use twink like it’s a slur wtf

10

Anonymous #35 2w

Stfu why do yall feel the need to defend gay men just cause their gay. They are still men

-1

Anonymous #26 2w

Female people is crazy lol

2

Anonymous #26 2w

This mindset is incredibly anti-trans but has a veneer of progressivism. This is so stupid and weird

10

Anonymous #26 2w

yeesh at this point just be transphobic. “females” really? dont call anyone whos not a woman or doesnt like the term female “female”. trans men are not female. and trans women are female, which youre implying theyre not. given this comment has 17 upvotes i think its pretty clear this community in general doesnt view trans peopleas the gender they are but rather as people pretending to be another gender

2

Anonymous #26 2w

as a trans person, you misunderstand the sex vs gender thing. sex ≠ gender, but its wrong to call a trans man female or a trans woman male bc male/female are gendered terms. and sex is the amalgamation of ALL physical characteristics, which change as you transition. as a trans woman im not “male” in the same way your dad is. this rhetoric can be extremely dangerois; im at risk for breast cancer but not considered at risk often bc im “male” (despite me having breasts and estrogen). pls think

5

Anonymous #3 2w

I didn’t say men should be in this community, I said we shouldn’t be homophobic. Homophobia is an extension of misogyny btw

4

Anonymous #36 2w

If this is genuine you are welcome but if this is some backhanded overused “I identify as a helicopter” right wing “gotcha” bullshit get out 🫩

11

Anonymous #23 2w

I agree with both you and 26 tbh. Nuance is a thing. Multiple things can be true at once. Trans men are men, and should not be lurking here. At the same time, this is similar to the discourse around he/him lesbians- sometimes the group you are no longer a LITERAL part of is the one that raised you and supported you and allowed you to succeed and be where you are now. Of course, even if he/him lesbians aren’t women, lesbians are still the group that they identify with.

7

Anonymous #38 2w

Kicking someone out of the group they may have relied on throughout their entire transition / experience is not a kind thing. That being said- that is ONLY if the he/him lesbian discourse applies. If a trans man doesn’t see women’s spaces as an integral part of his past support network, he shouldn’t be here.

1

Anonymous #38 2w

Like 34 said though, both of what we’re saying can be very slippery into “boy nonbinary and girl nonbinary” or “I see you as your body” rhetoric. That shit sucks. Lived experience discourse IS IMPORTANT but it has a time and place. That time and place is NOT when discussing gender validity.

1

Anonymous #38 2w

Also, the “they are also victims of certain forms of misogyny” is true, BUT- so are cis men. Everyone feels some negative impact of the patriarchy. If there is any similarity in how trans men experience misogyny and how women do, that is for trans men to decide if it is similar enough to seek support here. Thats not my or any woman’s choice to make for him. To lump trans men’s experience of misogyny in with our own feels very bio-essentialist, ESPECIALLY when said trans men

1

Anonymous #38 2w

Aren’t even being heard in the conversation. Too often we talk about them without them. Imo ultimately this is more of a trans man discourse thing then a women’s thing. Like, obviously we have the right to discuss if we feel our space is being intruded (as it so often is), but trans guys are SUCH A MINORITY on this issue it’s not even worth arguing over. Just leave them be.

1

Anonymous #34 2w

Yes and as another trans person, our bodies are still relevant to how we are treated. Not every trans person is medically transitioning. They might not be able to, they might not even want to. Obviously our terminology is flawed but every term is tainted here and you can apply good faith. Most of my friends are trans men and they do still face misogyny. Interpersonally and medically. Someone’s gender identity is made no less valid by their current sex. You can be a MAN who is also female

4

Anonymous #38 2w

I am non binary / trans masc. I don’t think someone’s identity has anything to do with the validity of their argument but according to you, this is my conversation to have and not yours. Cis men are not treated like women. Trans masculine people often are. It is an unfortunate reality but ignoring it only lets that discrimination fester and leaves us with nowhere to turn

4

Anonymous #38 2w

Are you seriously telling me that my identity is invalid because my political beliefs are different from yours? You don't know what you're talking about and that is insanely hurtful

0

Anonymous #35 2w

Getting downvoted for saying we shouldn’t be homophobic is crazy

4

Anonymous #36 2w

I’m not saying it because your belief is “different” I’m saying it because your belief (if your first comment WAS sarcasm) is rooted in hating irl people WHO HAVE DONE NO HARM

1

Anonymous #26 2w

I agree with you entirely, actually. I think my comment may have come off differently than I intended, but on the case it would have been harmful anyway I would be inclined to change it and agree with you. I do believe that this is your conversation.

1

Anonymous #37 2w

Woman is gender (psychological) female is sex (medical term for those with aligning body characteristics) that being said, unless your a doctor discussing something with a patient, DO NOT call women females. It’s so derogatory, specifically because “males” and “females” is used to describe animals, not people (again, unless it’s a medical context).

1

Anonymous #37 2w

“female” is dehumanizing, reducing us to our biological features rather than our entire personhood. You wouldn’t call a female animal a “woman” because that means a female human and implies personhood

0

Anonymous #38 2w

You did harm to me by blatantly telling me that my identity is "bullshit" and to "get out" (your words) so maybe take some time to reflect

-2

Anonymous #36 2w

Your whole world is a lie lol

5

Anonymous #36 2w

If your political beliefs are your identity, not just a part of it, I think you need to touch some grass. Also, im not talking harm as in hurting feelings. Im talking harm as in “upholding the built-in system that literally treats some minorities as subhuman and leads to their mistreatment and death” me saying “hey i think believing in that is bullshit” is not inflicting that system upon you, it is denouncing that the system should exist at all.

1

Anonymous #36 2w

However, im saying this immediately assuming your at least far right leaning BECAUSE you chose to enter this space and suggest hate to many of the people within it. Not all right wingers or republicans are extremist, or deserve to be hated, that is a dangerous way to think. But if you actively CHOSE to intrude HERE, I am going to call you an asshole.

1