LGBTQIA+ on Yik Yak | If willing, I’d like to understand how being a lesbian trans man isn’t hurtful to the lesbian label when being trans masc exists in addition to lesbian being a male exclusionary term? I’m genuinely asking, I want to learn from people and experiences.

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LGBTQIA+ 14w

If willing, I’d like to understand how being a lesbian trans man isn’t hurtful to the lesbian label when being trans masc exists in addition to lesbian being a male exclusionary term? I’m genuinely asking, I want to learn from people and experiences.

Anonymous 14w

I think it depends on the individual context of the label itself, Lesbian is often referred to as label for non-men loving non-men (as well as wlw). Queer identities get a little odd to navigate if you try to view it as only black and white, and the label of lesbian is one with a deep rooted history in non-conformism and a complex relationship with gender identity. I do know that not all trans masculine people are trans men and vice versa. Trans Masc is an umbrella term (in my personal opinion)

Anonymous 14w

I have an example from a person I know, but this isn’t to say this is the only way someone can use that label: I know an older guy who lived the first like 20-30 years of his life understanding himself to be a butch lesbian, engaging deeply w the lesbian community, etc. and being a butch lesbian was also a largely gendered experience, not just a sexuality label. at one point he came into contact with/came to understand that being a trans man was a more apt description of his experience and

Anonymous 14w

It’s kind of hard to hurt a label, because a label isn’t a person. If some trans man considers himself lesbian, that doesn’t mean lesbians in general have to be into trans men, or him. It definitely doesn’t mean that trans men are lesbians in general. That label relates to him personally and is maybe relevant to his partner(s). It isn’t a general statement.

Anonymous 14w

i wish more people would ask questions like this instead of getting mad at what they don’t understand. shoutout to you for asking in a kind manner.

Anonymous 14w

Trans masc and trans men are very different. A trans man is usually not gonna identify as a lesbian as they identify as a man. But trans masc individuals don’t always identify as men and often feel more comfortable using masculine terms or dressing more masculine but they’re not identifying as a man

Anonymous

#1 14w

Masculine doesn’t inherently mean male. It’s an alignment of gender. I would say the lesbian manifesto and the book “stone Butch blues” helps a lot with this if you’re a reader :))

Anonymous

#1 14w

I understand trans masc individuals identifying as lesbian for this exact reason, that I understand. But now I see the importance of not thinking so rigid about it. Non-men loving non-men makes sense to me. However, I still wonder about trans men, who are men, considering themselves a non-man in order to label themselves as lesbian? Again, I truly come from just curiosity and if I’m grossly overstepping I understand!

Anonymous

#2 14w

Right, that I understand. I know trans masc doesn’t automatically mean trans man or that they are a man. I was confused on individuals who are trans men not masc, identifying as lesbian. Thank you!

Anonymous

#3 14w

I see, thank you! I haven’t heard this perspective, only that in doing so (being a trans man and labeling yourself as a lesbian), lesbians and what they fought for were being minimized and their group invaded by men who claim to be lesbians. This is what I’ve heard from friends of mine. Again, I appreciate your response!

Anonymous

#4 14w

Thank you! I am truly a learner and the best way I know how to learn is by asking the people who experience these things on a daily! I truly mean no ill intent, my goals are to grow and stay empathetic, aware, and educated!

Anonymous

OP 14w

Personally I see the concept of trans men lesbians as being associated somewhat with old school lesbians. Like in the pre-internet era when there wasn’t quite as much interconnection to define things, and people used whatever definitions made sense to them in the context of their own queer community. Of course, some exist today. But I mean that it’s not a brand new concept by young trans men who want to invade lesbianism. It’s complicated because people and culture are complicated.

Anonymous

#3 14w

Understood. Thank you for bringing more historical context into this. I understand just how complicated these things are especially with all of the hate and negativity surrounding being oneself. I appreciate you for engaging in conversation with me and helping me grow my understanding of the world around me. 🤍

Anonymous

#5 14w

he started testosterone. but it’s also kind of like, that doesn’t suddenly make him not a member of the lesbian community that he’s been in for so much of his life. he’s still culturally a lesbian, still experiences attraction to lesbians and his own gender kind of from the perspective of a butch lesbian. so it’s not really accurate to his experience or reality to not acknowledge that in how he identifies himself

Anonymous

#5 14w

Wow, thank you for sharing. I’m glad he’s able to identify himself in a way that best suits him. This also makes a lot of sense to me and my brain (not that it matters ofc him and others are valid regardless) I appreciate you taking the time to share the is with me :)