Anonymous #2 17w

do you think my post is somehow transandophobic?

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Anonymous #3 17w

I think you’re exactly right. That’s why I usually try to explain it, even when whatever they said made me mad, because there’s a chance it’s actually just a misunderstanding. Although, I’ve found quite a lot of men get mad at ME for explaining it and complain about women not being more clear or whatever instead of just owning up to their mistake, but that’s beside the point

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Anonymous #2 17w

🚩. the term with the least baggage i’ve seen used by serious/well-meaning queer theorists is anti-transmasculinity.

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Anonymous OP 17w

I was curious since that word also gets floated around

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Anonymous #4 17w

I know very little about internet discourse but see a range of words that seem kinda similar to me, so ty for the info!

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Anonymous #2 17w

oh okay 😭 it seemed like you were accusing me of something lol I had never heard the word before you mentioned it, I had to look it up

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Anonymous OP 17w

Nah, I just thought that they might be somehow related/overlapping topics. Misandry is def not real (weirdly, sometimes I talk to people irl who say that misandry does exist systemically and that they agree with it? And I’m like uhmmmmm okay bestie & just kinda move on) & I've also seen discourse about the idea of transphobia specific to masculine identities

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Anonymous OP 17w

No I fully get you. I’ve had also men (cis and trans) get mad at me for trying to explain that if they’re not doing *the bad things* then they’re not the ones being talked about. It’s tiering- especially when they act like understanding where women are coming from equals being a “pick me”

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i’m not even going to dignify that with a proper reply 🤦‍♀️

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Anonymous OP 17w

You just did

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Anonymous #5 17w

what do think ‘proper’ means in this context? I know you’re not very smart but I thought you’d at least be able to read.

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Anonymous #2 17w

there are forms of transphobia that are specific toward transmasculinity. this is basic intersectional theory. oppression and marginalization do not function as merely additive (ex. black women do not experience racism + misogyny, they experience misogynoir—the misogyny they experience cannot be separated from the racism, in fact the *kind* of misogyny they experience is grounded in racism, and vice versa, the racism they experience cannot be separated from the misogyny which targets them.)

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Anonymous #2 17w

so yes, anti-trans masculinity is a real phenomenon that needs and deserves specific study and attention. there is just some tension because the history of many of it’s central figures (especially within online discourse) is deeply transmisogynistic. transmisandry and transandrophobia were both coined by transmisogynists, so i view their usage as a red flag (tho ik many may be unaware of this), which is why i suggested using the term anti-transmasculinity instead.

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Anonymous #2 17w

anti-transmasculinity also speaks directly to what is being targeted, instead of reifying problematic concepts (misandry) or trying to coin a direct corollary to transmisogyny (transandrophobia) (faulty premise). this tension is not exclusive to queer theory, ex there is tension between black male studies and black feminism. yes, the experiences of marginalized men are specific and need to be examined, but *some* reinforce misogynistic dynamics in their study and get called out.

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Anonymous #4 17w

Thank you for more information! One quick thing - I thought transmisogyny was coined by Julia Serrano? Am I missing some info about her?

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Anonymous #2 17w

yes she did. not sure where the confusion is coming in?

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Anonymous #4 17w

I didn’t know she was transmisogynist, unless I'm not reading what you said correctly? (I haven't read Whipping Girl, but I've read a couple of her free essays, and they seemed mostly fine. I was a little concerned about one or two parts, but when I brought them to others, they said they were fine)

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Anonymous #2 17w

she isn’t? i didn’t say or imply she was. i’m not sure where the confusion is coming from.

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Anonymous #2 17w

the people who coined transmisandry and transandrophobia were transmisogynists. julia serrano, the theorist who coined transmisogyny, is not a transmisogynist. anti-transmasculinity was not coined by transmisogynists and is used frequently by transfeminists + queer theorists.

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Anonymous #4 17w

OH I'm so sorry I completely read "transmisandry" as "transmisogyny" 😭 I learned a new word today too that’s completely my bad

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Anonymous #2 17w

no worries lol! just had to pinpoint where the communication breakdown was and i figured that’s what had happened.

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