Anonymous #5 3d

exactlyyy like if it looks like a girl then close enough

6

Anonymous OP 3d

sure gng 😭 I’m aroace so I don’t get it, sounds like y’all are having fun tho

7

Anonymous #6 2d

the way i see it, it's okay if the labels get misused bc gender doesn't need to make sense in the first place

5

Anonymous OP 2d

the problem is, flexible labels already exist! plus, being a man is adhering to a binary. nonbinary lesbians, yes! man lesbians, no. i’m totally open to trans non-women being lesbians so long as they aren’t specifically men.

-1

Anonymous #6 2d

you should try not caring ❤️

1

Anonymous OP 2d

but as a lesbian, i do! and i think you do too or you wouldn’t have initiated the discussion in the first place. discourse is a necessary part of understanding our community. but i also just don’t understand why men want to be lesbians in the first place. what about our label draws men to our identity when it literally means non-men loving non-men.

5

Anonymous #6 2d

maybe the contradiction is what draws someone with a confusing sense of gender to use that label. also, i meant not caring what other people do :) i initiated this bc you seem a little stressed about the idea of something not making sense but sometimes thats the point :)

1

Anonymous OP 2d

there are better labels that accommodate for flexible gender identities. this conversation only ever happens with lesbians because you don’t really hear about trans women wanting to be seen as achillean so to me it’s more of an issue with people wanting to water-down or change the meaning of lesbian. some labels aren’t flexible and that is okay. but i’m curious, do you think cis men can be lesbians?

7

Anonymous #6 2d

tbf there are, in fact, achillean/gay trans women, they simply aren’t brought up as a talking point

10

Anonymous #6 2d

cis men? no 😭

5

Anonymous #5 2d

i had no idea but thats really cool!

6

Anonymous #5 2d

the achillean identity is way debated than the lesbian identity, i’m not saying there aren’t people claiming that identity

8

Anonymous OP 2d

so is there a difference between the gender identity of a trans man and a cis man?

3

Anonymous #6 2d

the identity might be different but they're both men

1

Anonymous OP 2d

the identity is the same tho. they’re both men. so why is it different?

3

Anonymous #6 2d

one has trans in front of it, the other doesnt

1

Anonymous OP 2d

i guess i’m asking why is one type of man a valid lesbian but not the other? it feels like there is an underlying difference if you can accept one but not the other

4

Anonymous OP 2d

what does being trans have to do with sexuality

1

Anonymous #6 2d

one is valid bc there can be more going on with the gender that makes the lesbian label worth using instead of just being straight. the other doesnt need to describe anything complex because being cis is simple

1

Anonymous #6 2d

i think lesbian can be a gender label if you want it to be.

1

Anonymous OP 2d

i agree that lesbian can be a gender label. you’re still losing me with trans men being lesbians. i feel like labels lose their meaning when used based off of vibes and not what they stand for. it’s the reason we have so many, labels should fit you and if they feel restrictive then it wasn’t meant for you. idk agree to disagree. btw are you a lesbian?

5

Anonymous #6 2d

i think gender labels(especially non cis ones) are vibe based to begin with. feminine and masculine are more of a vibe than a list of qualifications, so if a label captures a type of vibe (like trans man+lesbian) then i think it works if the point is to describe a sort of contradicting vibe. and yes im a trans lesbian

0

Anonymous #6 2d

the way it’s been explained to me is that a trans guy lesbian (or at least the one I talked to) is that he personally hated being seen as a man by his partner during sexual/romantic activities but otherwise wanted to be seen as a man. outside of that, he said he was almost-but-not-quite a man (which I think translates to being a non-binary man)

8

Anonymous #5 2d

ya

3

Anonymous #6 2d

there’s a difference between a man (cis or trans) saying “I’m a lesbian” w/o a nuanced identity and a trans guy having a complex but genuine relationship with the label

7

Anonymous #5 2d

what is a non-binary man? how can you be non-binary but still identify with the binary.

0

Anonymous #6 2d

it's like she/they pronouns. you use both, but only one or the other wouldn't fully describe what you are

3

Anonymous OP 2d

she/they pronouns aren’t tied to a gender binary

3

Anonymous #6 2d

it was an analogy

1

Anonymous OP 2d

but that analogy doesn’t really work the same way. the entire idea of non-binary is to outside of the binary, so how can you also identify with the binary coincidentally. you’d just be non-binary and probably also masc.

3

Anonymous #6 2d

it works bc you'd just be both a man and a non binary person. it doesnt have to make sense

0

Anonymous #6 2d

like I said, it’s an almost-but-not-quite thing. it’s the best label that exists, but it doesn’t fully encompass or define his gender :) non-binary (wo)men aren’t very uncommon, my therapist is one lol

4

Anonymous #6 2d

You’re too focused on putting other people into your own boxes. If someone identifies as a nonbinary man because that’s the label that fits them best, they’re a nonbinary man. End of discussion

1